Committee Minutes

Grand Forks City Council Service/Safety Standby Committee
Tuesday, June 2, 2009 - 4:30 p.m._________ ___________

The Service/Safety Standby Committee met on Tuesday, June 2, 2009 at 4:30 p.m. in Room A101 in City Hall with Committee Chair Kreun presiding. Present at roll call were Kreun, Bjerke, Bakken, Gershman.

Others present included: Al Grasser, Chief Packett, Todd Feland, Mark Walker, Howard Swanson, Officer Braaten.

1. Clay removal of Belmont Road levee.
Al Grasser, city engineer, stated they have been working with the Corps re. clay that was put on the Belmont levee during the flood, that Corps was concerned about putting that on and directed that upon completion would need to remove the clay. He stated they had put some options to the Corps on how they might leave the clay on the top, but Corps saying that decision would have to go to Washington at their headquarters, and likely would not be approved. However, they had also requesting putting the clay and creating a sledding hill access ramp to keep the clay in the vicinity and make some beneficial use of the clay, are getting some support from the District staff and expecting to get a favorable response so be able to do that, letter may be coming within next week or so. FEMA will reimburse the City for the cost of putting the clay on and removal of the clay, City has to put the time in and that was big part of the consideration. The Corps is finishing things in Fargo and Valley City so in the next couple weeks may see the Corps starting to do the removal and if things work out will have an approval from the District to build that ramp and can move that clay to that location.

Kreun stated that we would have that available nearby if we needed that again, and that if have steps on sledding hill will have to shovel, etc. Mark Walker stated that we don't know for sure that Corps will give approval on that. Mr. Grasser stated that if in the event we don't get that approval, will be trucking it off to a disconnected site some place else, he also stated that the City will have to pay for some topsoil and seeding otherwise FEMA will take case of the bulk of the cost.

2. Grand Forks Landfill Slope Stabilization Project and New Landfill Project
updates._________________________________________________________
Todd Feland, director of public works, stated there would be four items related to the landfill on the coming COW meeting and presented updates:

1) the new landfill and roadway construction bid item will be on the agenda, however, the bid will not be opened until Tuesday, and staff report will be updated after the bid opening and will be on the city council agenda.

2) Another item that will be on the agenda is to request permission to retrofit the other EnviroBale bagging system, cost is the same amount that we retrofitted the other baler. $99,000. This is a 2-man system, looked at the 1-man system and that system doesn't really reduce the amount of people-power you need to work and are going with the same system that we have.

He stated he had discussion with Patrick James, executive director of Airport Authority Board, that we are tied to the completion/operation of the E/W runway and appears that runway will be completed sometime in August, little behind because of frost, etc. and council asked him to go to Airport Authority to see if we can extend completion of our solid waste landfill with completion of runway, looking at about two months - that we are going to complete our construction in October, and need to get it okayed by the FAA. We need to concur with the Department of Health, will continue to do all the bird mitigation that we are currently doing at our existing site. He stated he would like to have a resolution passed by the city council on Monday's COW, and have the Airport Authority forward that to the FAA for their concurrence. Feland stated that wouldn't delay the opening but that they would finish by August 15, we would finish our project on October 15 and they would be able to use that runway with our ending, knowing in two months that we are going to be moving out of there. We don't want to affect their project and it will be part of the conditions, but obviously want the support of the Airport Authority and have them move that to the FAA Office for their concurrence. Mr. James stated they will have to pass it through the FAA and up the chain as they have been involved with this. Feland stated that once the resolution is passed, he would forward that to the Airport Authority Board for their consideration, requesting modification of the current agreement that we have with them. It was noted that they might include "not to exceed two months" and that might help.

Feland stated they are trying to complete half the fill this year so the west half of the cell is scheduled for completion this year and the other half of the cell will be completed next year; there will be a storm water berm that will go across half of that cell and that will allow placing solid waste in this cell this fall. This is an attempt for us to make sure we get an operational landfill and then we can finish the cell next year according to construction schedule.

4) He stated we have a draft agreement with the City of Fargo to use their landfill for up to six months if we have to and would like to get that approved, Mr. Swanson needs to add a final review and would be subject to review of both attorneys it and will be on the COW agenda.

Bjerke questioned re. lawsuit - Mr. Swanson stated they have made a motion to dismiss, it has been briefed and Judge Erickson held a hearing in Fargo and waiting for ruling

There was a short presentation by Melissa Knutson, CPS, of the landfill slope stabilization project, giving background on the project, cost and future expectations. Original contract amount was just under $725,000 and anticipate final contract just under $730,000, and total est. cost would be on the entire on-going project and little over $1.1 million. Project should be completed within next couple weeks.

Feland stated that the $1.1 million - reviewed information relative to conversations/e-mails, etc. with the Airport Authority, their attorney, Mr. Myerchin; consultant, Ulteig; and contractor, Zavoral. That in the end did have some conversations with Ulteig and Zavoral and further conversations with Ulteig; that Mr. Johnson left and Mr. Patrick has taken over now and there was a time where Ulteig was interested in meeting with the City without their attorney but in the interim got e-mail back from the attorney that not interested and that is where they are with Ulteig at this time.

Part of our concern is that they didn't have a right of entry to go onto City property and their project, their truck drove over the landfill and did some modifications to the ditch which affected the landfill, but does feel that Ulteig didn't do all the things they necessarily should have done with this project and that impacted the City's planned development, didn't do the study and that accounted for the $140,000 and that study didn't show that there was an impact of that project of both the excavating and truck traffic on the landfill; part of our want was to have discussion of the project and what felt and did contribute toward the effect.

Feland stated to that had conversation with Mr. Swanson re. potential for litigation - that he would like to request that the city council authorize that action. Mr. Swanson stated he is asking for council action, has had communication and it is very clear to him that Ulteig Engineering is taking the ends off the approach and they don't want to discuss - that he has had significant communication with the insurer for Zavoral as well as the attorney that has been obtained to represent Zavoral. There are a number of issues that will ultimately need to be addressed, and at this point that they are serious about resolving this issue and that would be authorized to initiate appropriate action. Feland stated that this would be another COW item.

Gershman informed Mr. Patrick that he might want to notify Ulteig that this is going to be on the agenda and will be approved by city council and give a two weeks head up. Feland stated that on Monday get a general review of the project - and to authorize city attorney's office to commence activities would be the agenda item. Committee consensus was to do that.

3. Information re. Alcoholic Beverages:
Kreun stated that sometime ago committee had given listing of items they would like to have more information on and asked Chief Packett and Office Braaten to provide that info to the committee.

a) Party buses and related alcohol consumption/dancing, buses transporting intoxicated passengers from one bar to another - Buses transporting intoxicated passengers from one bar to another/dancing.

Chief Packett stated committee had received report that Sgt. Burgess and Officer Braaten put together earlier this year and reviewed report - that there are 3 primary areas, have commercially hired which is transporting wedding parties, birthday parties, etc.; have alcohol establishments that own or lease buses and designed to transport patrons to and from an event and their business, and entrepreneurs who for a fee pick people up from areas of town and take to areas where liquor licenses are established and return them to a set point - one of them provides music, etc. Question was asked if alcohol can be provided on the buses. Mr. Swanson stated you cannot serve alcohol on a bus unless you were a licensed commercial venture and have to have a license - that if owner/operator of the bus was putting cooler of alcohol on bus and providing that as part of the payment for the bus, that would not be legal. That if individual leasing the bus and providing his own alcohol to his party not an issue as far as licensing- not a licensed premise so no prohibition of minors being there. - but if minors consuming would be problem.

Bjerke asked under Home Rule Charter do we have laws stricter than State law, Mr. Swanson stated no if criminal law, possibly if non-criminal. It was noted there has to be separation between passengers and drivers. - limos have separation between passengers and driver. Swanson stated if question is can we prohibit alcohol on transportation units of any size in the city of Grand Forks, can research that. He stated re. party bus, we have no local regulation in effect; no criminal responsibility unless an accident occurs, but if looking for civil liability in event of tort action, there is potential liability for an operator or driver depending upon specific details and what occurs -

Kreun asked if an establishment transports to and from activity, if responsible for the over-serving of an individual on that bus or if some kind of accident that takes place with that individual. Swanson stated they are referring to dram shop liability and that is dependent upon the service of alcohol on a licensed premise - a bus is not considered a licensed premise, but has not researched whether there are cases that would impose liability in view of that - a bar owner cannot serve an habitual drunkard (not sure what that is and not sure even constitutional to even have in there), somebody under the age of 21 or somebody who is obviously intoxicated -

Discussions re. difference between categories - 1 and 3. Braaten stated the commercially hired owner wants bus to go from to x to x, etc. and don't hire out to the general public, doesn't charge fee, picks up people at specific spot or along the way and drops off downtown, and later picks up and takes back. Swanson stated under current code we require local license for taxicab and taxi driver, require current local license for handicapped transportation services and require license for airport limousine service - this type of activity is not taxi because not using a meter, not charging destination fees - not airport limousine because not going to and from designated location to the airport and not handicapped - we currently have no code that regulates either the service or the operators of their service - that we have the equipment inspected and reviewed and drivers checked out. He stated would be policy question if want to outlaw it, they are competing public interests, one of the things accomplished is that you are discouraging DUI's and have people on the bus because they shouldn't be driving - hasn't done any research as to what communities might have done or regulations imposed or type of license and is something they could do - there are pros and cons whether should or shouldn't do service of that nature - Committee stated they should look at that. Swanson stated they would do research as to what other communities have adopted regs., etc. license - insurance requirements, equipment, etc.

b) Open containers on sidewalks.
It was noted when City gives businesses permits to serve food on sidewalks, it extends their alcohol license. Swanson stated you cannot have liquor container in a public right of way except where authorized by the city council and authorizations that have come forward for the sidewalk service have to be included in the service of alcohol.

Gershman stated his observations is that the following morning there is broken glass, etc. on street and if bars closing at 2:00 a.m., would hope not allow drinks to be taken out of business.
Kreun stated they have worked with the business establishments, but haven't met with the landlords - concern with landlords that create as much of a problem as liquor establishments - have heard complaints from two snow removal companies that in the winter time when doing snow removal on private property that from parts above bombarded with beer bottles, cans, etc. at 2:00 to 3:00 in the morning - so will work with landlords to alleviate some of that problem, etc. It was also noted that many establishments with outdoor service do not serve anything in glass, use plastic containers, etc. There were some comments that have stricter policy so cannot have drinks/containers in their hands when going from one bar to another.

Chief Packett stated there is problem on 3rd and 4th Streets in 3 block area from midnight until 2:00 a.m. because buses/limos and taxis load/unload passengers - should have specific parking areas on temporary basis from 11:00 to 1:30 a.m. Kreun stated that would be one of his requests as to how they could do that so can pick them up and drop off at peak times.

c) Over-serving.
Bjerke stated if buses take people from bar to bar, thinks it is a problem - clear that over-serving. Packett stated it is sometimes challenge for establishments once shut somebody off and what do with them, and that is when get called to assist the businesses - covered on server training on recognition, etc. Swanson stated the only one that can be charged for over-serving is somebody who has a license - not bus operator nor limo operator - keep in mind there is not a prohibition of serving alcohol to somebody who may become intoxicated - prohibition is that you cannot serve someone who is obviously intoxicated -

d) How to address false/fake ID's
Bjerke asked how could the City do a better job of taking care of people with fake i.d.'s Swanson stated that if you believe you have patron that has a false i.d., take it and hold it and call police dept - turn it into the police department and leave it up to the police department to prosecute, they have more ability to do something if i.d. is turned over to them rather than giving it back to the patron. Investigation from police department re. false i.d. would leave stronger message, than a bartender asking them to leave; that it may not lead to prosecution but troubled by not doing anything about it. Reps. of Industry stated if called police dept., they come and get it but nothing seems to be getting done.

Chief Packett stated they need to clear the air today and city attorney has the best point of the day, that if they have an instrument that is false, they need to call the police department and they will follow up on that. It was also noted that number of calls from specific establishment to the police department will not affect licensing. Swanson stated that if establishment thinks that p.d. has taken adverse action against your license because of the fact that you turned somebody in for illegal act, don’t sign name, don't put address in it, but let him know if you think that is happening. Kreun stated that calls for service have no bearing whatsoever on any relicensing, etc. Swanson stated that there are several ordinances on possession of attempting to use an altered i.d., attempting to use a false id., enforcement is not an easy enforcement but if don't know about it, don't have a chance to enforce it.

e) City ordinance restricting "specials"
Swanson stated there are none. Kreun asked if there is a need to restrict or leave as is. Chief Packett stated it could be a benefit to them on occasion because it comes up at least once a year of specials attached to events - have sent out a lot of letters in the past asking for cooperation during certain events but hasn't been very successful - that businesses that cooperate are penalized because other establishments go ahead and do it, kind of a policy question for council that if want a level playing field for all the businesses - Kreun asked if would need it all the time or would you be able to impose it on specific events - Swanson stated they would want to do research on that. Packett stated if want overall improvement of the community as a whole, have to look at it as a year round policy decision. Rep of industry stated they don't allow patrons to buy large amounts of drinks - allow 2 drinks, 50 cents off regular price. Kreun asked if more sense not to have "happy hour" - Swanson stated one thing that need to keep in mind on reviewing restrictions, that would not apply across the river. Committee asked that this be researched.

f) MIP (minor in possession) identifying source, buyers, etc.
Comm. stated this caused by family members in homes more so than Hospitality group, and if we able to follow through with parents that have party at home and serve minors, etc. Swanson stated gave report some time ago on that, and was well reported trail in Grand Forks on that. He interrupted this item as not relating to licensed establishments - but as group of high school students or college students who have large quantities of alcohol and question is where did they get it - and sometimes find out it was brother, sister, friends, parents, or stranger. This is an area that if people don't talk and don't have other information or sources to gather information, that is difficult one to prosecute. Bjerke stated that don't know how to track it but when arrest minor and they don't want to cooperate, would like to see them prosecuted to the full extent and would like to know disposition of those cases. Swanson stated under the age of 18 they go to juvenile court and those records are sealed and don't have ability to get that type of information - but if over the age of 18 and under 21 you are a minor for purposes of alcohol, those go to municipal court, that he has information and would provide that info. to committee. That if charged with State violation, goes to District Ct. and left with the discretion of the Court to a max. of what they can or can't do. Swanson stated if brought into Municipal Court, they may appeal to District Court;
have to have the evidence to prove and a minor caught with alcohol has a constitutional right to say absolutely nothing and can't use that against them but what can do is provide a lesser sentence if they cooperate, can say if you cooperate we will see if we can't get you a lighter sentence, that can be earned in the constitution protection given to somebody who has been charged with any offense. He stated he can tell you what the bond is in Municipal Ct. but can't tell you what District Court will do because they have further discretion, and what you would do on City Code would not affect what a District Court judge would do.

g) Hair salons serving alcohol.
Kreun stated that some business at opening serve wine or champagne , who controls the license on those issues. Swanson stated that has given report on 2 occasions that is if the issue is with respect to hair salons providing alcohol along with their services is illegal - with respect to a grand opening and if invitation only and probably not a public sale, get into very gray area, in most cases we advise them to contract with a private licensed premise and that happens very frequently. The wine/walk is a catered event and there was recently approved permit for business downtown having an anniversary event and that was catered. Caterer has a temporary license and pay a fee for that - pre-event application form. But if come in for service and get free wine, that is illegal. He stated that they get calls periodically about somebody who has open house, etc. or want to invite their best customers to come in for BBQ, use our discretion on that, encourage them to have a licensed caterer do that, but don't think will send out team because somebody doing that - get very few complaints or issues. Packett stated once made aware Det. Flannery will go out and have a chat with the business; and many businesses are not aware of that. Swanson stated if that is a particular issue that committee has concern with, give names and addresses and they will send informational letter stating that they may or may not be aware of this - would prefer to handle it that way and make that information to them.

Braaten stated when first started compliance checks everyone got one warning; and letters re. server training sent out 22nd giving attendance record of their employees and a print out of all their employees that had attended server training and to send him their list - to date has received 9 back out of 64, has had another class and people are calling - a lot of people left after graduation/school and are in the process of hiring more - on-line registration been good, but only half the class shows up - reluctant to add more classes, taking spots but no one is coming. Bakken stated we are being very patient but if no training no license.

Rep of industry stated they should have meeting with police department every couple years to talk about concerns, and asked if could put server training online and no personnel costs, and get certificate rather than trying to schedule people to attend meetings on specific day - working with public info. office might be able to put something like that together rather than having officers doing the training. Bjerke stated that perhaps Chief Packett could set up meeting once year with Hospitality Assn. Another suggestion was to have people come in and take the test and leave.

There were several issues for the city attorney's office to research, including regulation of party buses, and of limo services, parking services from 10 to 2; allowance of adoption of regulations for drink specials, happy hours, etc.

A woman in the audience stated she worked at University of ND, but asking as community member, that at every community event there seems to be alcohol, and question is do we need to have alcohol at a garage sale (Alerus) and if that is a question or concern - Bjerke stated that every public event seems to have alcohol. Kreun stated major contributing factor to alcohol with minors comes in the home - to pinpoint these and/or adult activities that kids come to, doesn't know if that is major problem in a community, but alcohol being provided to minors by family members, etc., and if reduce that problem will have a lot less problem with minors in consumption than if keep hammering on these people and/or the public. This is not t necessarily the City's responsibility - goes back to educational responsibility of parents and/or maybe school, that City doing what we can with business establishments - doesn't see too many of these meetings taking place other than the City - 75% of the problem comes from homes - and to keep pounding on public entities of people trying to make a living and/or trying to make the Alerus Center profitable, may or may not be part of it.

Kreun asked Mr. Swanson to let Haga or Packett know when have information and put it back on the agenda. - Swanson will review what different communities nationally have done in these areas and come back with report, provide written information first before putting on the agenda.

ADJOURN

The meeting adjourned at 6:30 p.m.

Alice Fontaine
City Clerk